[MassHistPres] Double Glazed Replacement Windows

Mon Apr 27 09:10:30 EDT 2009

dennis....
thanks for your concise and convincing feedback in regard to replacement windows...pat patrick and i are members of the new england window restoration alliance and know full well the wasted financial investment--not to mention the petro-chemical environmental dangers inherent in vinyl windows--in replacement windows...you may be familiar with the Peabody town hall that is undergoing removal of failed 20 year old replacement windows....

it is ever more difficult to convince old home owners that repair/restoration is the most cost effective investment concerning windows...there is a huge window replacement blitz in the making...Anderson reps have been seen going door to door in Arlington, there are TV and newspapers ads aplenty and take a look at this: http://www.prweb.com/releases/window/leads/prweb1927964.htm and this: http://www.homeimprovement-salestraining.com/  perhaps you'd like to drop mar. Yoho a line...

I have offered a price for complete restoration that includes interior and exterior painting and storm window purchase and installation for 99 windows at the Belchertown town hall...the price for vinyl replacements is less than half that of mine...Marvin replacements were $235,000 more than my price...out of the 5 select board members, 3 are for replacements, 2 are for restoration...the issue will go to a town wide vote in may...though i may not be awarded the contract, i plan to be there to champion the right choice...wish me luck!

this is one of two articles that appeared in the local paper...  http://www.masslive.com/hampfrank/republican/index.ssf?/base/news-19/1239866230282200.xml&coll=1  my price has been inflated and it includes a LOT more work than installation of replacement windows...i'd like to suggest that mr. appleton return to school to take a class in journalistic objectivity...

if i may, i'd like to forward your remittance to the belchertown selectboard...

as an example of how amazingly gullible some folks can be when it comes to marketing, SPAM lunch meat (yuk!) has enjoyed a 'double digit' increase in sales after a recent advertising campaign....

thanks again for your input...

jade mortimer
heartwood window restoration (note new name)
hawley, ma
413-339-4298
  ----- Original Message ----- 

  From: Dennis De Witt 
  To: MHC MHC listserve 
  Sent: Monday, April 27, 2009 8:31 AM
  Subject: Re: [MassHistPres] Double Glazed Replacement Windows

  Pat

  The short answer is that Brookline requires retention of existing windows (allowing absolute single-glazed TDL like-kind replacement per MGL 40c) -- because windows are important original fabric and because no credible economic or green argument can be made for replacing them vs adding good storms.  

  We do have one LHD with some interwar houses with steel casements.  Because they are not easy or inexpensive to repair, and because there is no really satisfactory storm system for them for someone who wants to open their windows, we have allowed their replacement on a hardship basis (the hardship relating to the repair, technical, and design issues specific to those windows) with similar aluminum and fiberglass frames.  It is not fully satisfactory.  Neither alternative has as thin frames or muntins.  We have variously allowed both TDLs and single units with adhered non-flat muntins.  The former gives more realistic reflectivity but the muttons are too wide while the latter, like all non-TDLs, reflects like a single sheet of glass, with the funhouse mirror effect typical of IG.

  I assume you know that replacements with modern (post 1980s) organically sealed insulating glass (IG) do not make any sense economically as compared to repair combined a good triple track [e.g. Harvey Tru-Channel].   Modern IG will always fail (cloud up) -- typically before they have paid for themselves.  Good tight storms will deliver 90% of the replacement widow's efficiency at a fraction of the cost and will never fail.  As you may also know good storms are available with Low-e glass.  Low-e can be used to in such a way as to allow solar gain in and keep it in for winter heating economy or to keep solar gain out for air conditioning economy.  All except some expensive custom replacement windows are, as a matter of course, made for southern summers rather than for northern winters.  With locally available storms, the opposite is true.  As you may also know, wood framed, triple track-like storms with triple track-like lower sash/screens are also available with low-e.

  Dennis De Witt
  Brookline

  Below is an article from the Globe which I posted a while back.  Interestingly, this particular house is in a Brookline LHD, although that was not mentioned in the article and does not seem to have impacted the recommendations.  Chris has the illustration that went with it.  The article is about making homes more energy efficient.  The illustration shows the cost, savings payback periods of various energy saving investments.  Note the last item:

  Air Sealing — payback:2.5 years
  Storm doors and storm windows — payback 13-15 years
  Door weather stripping — payback 2.5 years
  Aircrete foam wall insulation — payback 6.5 years
  Cellulose attic floor insulation — payback 9 years
  New furnace of boiler — payback 8 years
  Replacement windows — payback up to 33 years 
  (That's longer than the lifetime of the insulating glass!  Note the 6th paragraph from the bottom below)

  These are said to be average numbers based in information from Conservation Services Group, a non-profit entity which does energy audits -- I think largely for public utilities.

  When I first sent this story out Chris made the following comment:

  Interestingly, I had an energy audit on my 1850 house with all original
  6 over 6 windows last winter.  While they need some rehabilitation, we
  have plugged all of the gaps with mortite so there is very minimal
  infiltration.  I didn't tell the auditor where I worked or what I did
  for a living.  I fully expected him to bring up the windows and that
  they needed to be replaced but he didn't.  At the end of the audit, I
  asked him about the windows.  His response, "Oh, don't replace your
  windows.  You won't see savings for 30 years."  

  The following is the text of the article — less a deleted section on financing:

   So, this is the year you're finally going to bring your house in from the cold? You're not alone, and there's help available from many places to narrow the number of winterization choices to the most effective, and steer clear of the costly.  Despite the retreat in oil prices, heating fuel costs remain high - home heating oil, for example, is in the mid-$3-a-gallon range.

  Numbers like these were the tipping point for Brookline resident Rebecca Mailer-Howat. Her household held off for years before spending thousands of dollars last month on an energy-efficient retrofit of their 1870s Colonial Revival. The Mailer-Howats started with an ecologically friendly insulation foam called Aircrete, which was blown inside the walls of the house, and then expanded to fill in airways and hidden gaps and holes. Next the family plans to upgrade its hot water system, and add solar panels.

  "I always wanted to do it, but circumstances have indicated that we should hurry up," Mailer-Howat said. "And everything's just going to keep getting more expensive."

  Like Mailer-Howat, homeowners hoping to dodge the winter heating bullet should get going now. But be cautious about spending large sums on big-ticket projects that may do little to lower your bills.

  Bruce Harley, technical director at the nonprofit efficient energy consultant Conservation Services Group, said there are multiple ways homeowners can cut heating costs by themselves. He divides home winterization into four primary elements: insulation, air sealing, ductwork, and heating equipment.

  "I liken insulation and air sealing to the sweater-windbreaker analogy. Neither one alone is going to keep you warm on a chilly day, but put them together and it's a really good system," said Harley, who has authored two books on home energy-saving projects. Filling walls with cellulose, foam, or fiberglass insulation can boost the house's R-value (the measure of its thermal resistance) from an insulation-free 3, to a whopping 12. But air leaks - gaps, slits, and other hidden openings - throughout a house can defeat that improvement. "Ideally the contractor seals leaks as part of the prep for insulation," Harley said. "Of course, some contractors understand this much better than others."

  Finding those air leaks, however, is not always easy. They are sometimes behind walls, along chimneys, or in dark and hard-to-reach spaces in the attic or in the basement where the house foundation meets the sill.

  And, because some of these gaps can be tucked away doesn't mean they are small. According to Hurley, they can be "large enough to put your arm or head through; even newer homes often have large air leaks that render insulation practically useless." These gaps can be plugged with a variety of foams, or other insulation and even closed off with sheet metal.

  While most New England homes are spared the expense of energy loss via ductwork, Harley said, sealing such pathways where they do run - typically in crawl spaces or garages - becomes critical to capturing the benefits of new insulation.

  And that leaves the heat generator itself; the hardware in the basement. "If your furnace or boiler is more than 20 years old, chances are it's reaching the end of its service life," Harley said.

  Homeowners can realize enormous savings by replacing old systems with modern, certified high-efficiency boilers and furnaces. Though they run into the thousands of dollars, new heating systems will yield immediate savings in fuel consumption, savings that can pay for the upgrade within 10 years.

  But Harley and Berry cautioned homeowners to think twice about some big ticket items - chief among them are new replacement windows. Often the costs of the new windows far outweigh the savings they deliver. "When you look at the amount of space your windows take up compared to the overinsulated portion of wall space, it is most likely cheaper and more cost effective to add additional insulation to a wall," Berry said.

  For far less money - as much as half the price - new exterior storm windows can be a smart investment in increasing the efficiency of aging windows, because they slow the loss of heat from inside and reduce air leakage. Meanwhile Harley identified other energy efficiency measures that don't pay off, including duct cleaning (as opposed to sealing), fan-fold insulation board used in typical re-siding projects, and anything marketed as "reflectivity" or radiant barrier.

  These include thin insulation with foil layers and, believe it or not, paint. "They always have hugely inflated claims for R-value, which are simply not justified by physical reality, Harley said.

  For some homeowners, conventional costs are not the only consideration. The Mailer-Howats wanted to use environmentally beneficial products, so for insulation, they chose Aircrete, a magnesium oxide expanding foam, which is fireproof and nontoxic, over the more common blown-in cellulose insulation. Aircrete costs $2.70-per-square-foot, compared to $1.40 or more for cellulose.

  "We always wanted to do this, but what we wanted was something that made sense ecologically and environmentally, that didn't have any toxic complications," said Patrick L. Mailer-Howat, as workers from All Weather Green Insulation scaled ladders at his home in preparation for the installation.

  "We're not bleeding heart, naive hippie children," added Mailer-Howat, who is chairman of Vita Bio Group, a biomass energy development business. "We are interested in being proactive in our husbandry of resources, with an outlook to a mid- to long-term future. I mean this is my retirement home."

  On Apr 27, 2009, at 5:58 AM, Pat Patrick wrote:

    As chair of the Old and Historic Districts Commission,Marblehead, I am tasked with surveying other historic commissions and boards regarding to allow or to deny double glazed replacement windows in our historic districts.  I would appreciate some feedback on how other towns approach this matter.  We currently require true divided lite, wood, single glazed replacement windows.  Exceptions are allowed on a case by case basis.

    Pat Patrick

    James M. "Pat" Patrick
    OldTownRepair
    2 Pleasant Court, Ground Floor Office
    Marblehead, MA  01945-3310
    781-631-5145 (P)
    781-639-8024 (F)
    pat at oldtownrepair.com
    www.oldtownrepair.com

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